Top 5 Things That Divorced Parents Can Do to Make the Holidays More Enjoyable For Their Children - Bella Duncan

In this episode of the Dad to Dad's Podcast, Robert and Bella Duncan discuss the challenges divorced parents face during the holiday season. They share practical tips to ensure children feel secure and happy, emphasizing the importance of logistics, emotional support, and thoughtful gift-giving. Bella highlights the need for parents to avoid conflict and focus on creating positive memories for their children, reminding listeners that kids only get one childhood.

Takeaways

• Work out the holiday schedule early to avoid confusion.
• Assure your kids that you will be okay when they are with the other parent.
• Avoid discussing contentious issues during the holidays.
• Encourage your kids to give thoughtful gifts to their co-parent.
• Remember that your kids only get one childhood, make it count.
• Logistics help children feel secure and reduce their anxiety.
• Children often worry about their parents' happiness during the holidays.
• Keep adult conversations separate from children's experiences.
• Create a positive holiday atmosphere for your kids.
• Focus on the joy of the holidays rather than personal

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Transcript

Robert (00:00)
Hey everyone and welcome back to the dad to dad's podcast. And today you will definitely notice a familiar face in this episode. One of my favorite guests, Bella Duncan from a kid with two homes, Bella. Welcome back.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (00:14)
Thank you so much for having me, Robert. So excited to be back again.

Robert (00:17)
Well, thank you. And so as some of you are probably aware, I'm a divorced dad with two amazing sons. And as many divorced parents know, the holiday season can sometimes be mentally and emotionally challenging if you're not with your children. However, while it can be hard on us as parents, we need to do all that we can to eliminate any of the stress or the

discomfort that our children might face so they can truly experience and enjoy the holidays again, no matter how hard it is on us. remember they didn't ask to be in this situation. So it's our job to shield them from any negative thoughts or feelings that we might be experiencing. So with that in mind, I reached out to Bella the other day and challenged her to come up with

the top five things that divorced or separated parents can do to make the holidays easier and more enjoyable for their children. Bella, I know there's more than just five and you've had to condense it down, but let's jump into it. Tell me what are the top five.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (01:28)
Mm-hmm.

All right, I'm gonna give you the top five. We're outline them and then let's brake them down and go through each one. How does that sound? All righty, number one, number one. This is major and this is kind of the first step as well. Work out the holiday schedule, whether it's already worked out by court orders or whether you still are yet to determine it. Now is the time. If this episode is being released next week or so, now is the time to organize the schedule, but also the logistics.

Robert (01:38)
Let's do it. Sounds great.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (02:03)
and explain it to your kids. Remind them if it's the same as last year, if it's the same as, you know, it's always been, if it's changing up, explain it to your kids. That's number one. Logistics schedule, explain to your kids. Number two, assure your kids you're going to be okay during the holiday period when they are not with you. This is a major one, and this is a high level stress theme for kids with divorce.

When they're not with you, they worry about your happiness and your loneliness. So assure them that you will be okay. Number three, avoid the conflict and any highly contentious matters around this time. This is a general principle, of course, always, but specifically around the holiday period. Number four, this is a tough one and it's hard to drill into parents, but help your kids get your co-parent

present. Very specific to let's say Christmas Day. But this is a general principle that we can make a bit more general but number four is help your kids get a present or organize or check in with them about getting your co-parent a present. And number five, remember your kids only get one childhood. And this is kind of going to be that North Star of

Robert (03:19)
good.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (03:30)
helping you put into place one, two, three and four by remembering number five, your kids only get one childhood.

Robert (03:38)
Bella, I love it. That's awesome. That's awesome. Let's kind of go through those and yeah, let's can we can we start with number one?

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (03:40)
So, yeah.

100%. This is definitely where we start. Logistics, schedule, all righty. So obviously everybody's schedule, everybody's situation is going to be unique to them. Like I said, there might be some court orders that this has already been pre-planned years ago. But the thing is, your kids don't always know this. It might not be age appropriate for them to know what a court order is. It might not be in their realm of thinking of,

Robert (03:49)
All right, let's do it, logistics.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (04:17)
what's a holiday schedule going to look like. If you haven't already organized it, it's time to organize it now. What days, who's going to be with who, when, or what weeks, and specifically with a focus on these coming holidays, Christmas day and the day surrounding that. So schedule, lock it in and the logistics, but explain it to your kid as well. So for example, I'll give you an example of when

My brother and I were growing up. Our day on Christmas day always looked the same, but it was a busy day. We literally went to six different places on Christmas day. We'd start with mom, we'd wake up at mom's. We'd go to my grandmother's. We'd go to our extended family with mom. We'd swap over, which was supposed to be around 12 PM.

This changed every year. Sometimes it was 12 PM, sometimes it was as late as 3 PM. We'd go to Dad. We'd meet at a Maccas car park every year. And then we'd go to Dad's. We'd go to our extended family at Dad's and then we'd go to our grandmothers at night to finish off. And then we'd say bye Dad's. And this day was manic. Luke and I felt like we were in the car majority of the day. But for us, it was important that we saw both our parents and now

without co-authors, with now being both adults ourselves, we still do this transition on Christmas day. But what is helpful for kids, whether you're going to six different places, whether you're just going to one and you're just being with one parent on that day, it's important that they know what's going to happen before it happens. And I find that it's...

Robert (06:01)
Yeah. No, that's, that's good. I was going to ask you, why is it so important to have the logistics worked out? mean, I think I know, but yeah.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (06:11)
Of course, because if you don't have a logistics workout, your kids are going to think it's their responsibility to look after the logistics. And it might not be age appropriate. might not, it not only might not be age appropriate, but it's definitely not their responsibility. This is the adult things.

Robert (06:25)
Right. And keep them out of working, keep them out of this. Like this is between you and the co-parent.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (06:30)
Absolutely.

That's it. And when you're working out this schedule and the logistics, of course, there might be some contention around, well, I want the kids for Christmas this year. I can't be without the kids. The kids should be, it should be split down the middle on Christmas day. We should both get to see them. But if you both know that's not right for your kids and that's not what your kids want, they just want to have a chill day on Christmas day. And then they can celebrate, say, for example, Christmas day with mom or dad on Boxing Day. Then maybe that's something that you guys can consider.

Robert (06:58)
Yeah, yeah.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (07:01)
It's, it's of course unique to your situation. And if it does end up being split down the middle on Christmas day, and I'm using Christmas day as an example, like it was for us, because that's what works for you and your family, then that's okay too. But work out those logistics, work out and explain those logistics to your kids. Because although we had a lot of instability on Christmas day, we did have certain reference points that we knew were going to happen. We all knew we were going to meet my dad at that specific McDonald's car park every year.

And there was at least that level of consistency of we know where we're going. We know what time we're going this year. And we know, you know, what the pickup drop off kind of situation is going to look like before we have to kind of tackle that highly emotional time. so explaining that and telling them, Hey, we've done the adult talk. We've done the adult stuff and we've organized it. And this is what's going to happen because we, as your parents want to guide and you know, know what we think is best for you guys.

And this is what we've planned so you don't have to worry about it.

Robert (08:04)
I think that's wonderful. I think that's wonderful. I want to move to number two, assuring the kids that you're okay. Do kids really worry about the other parent? And I will say this, I have seen where parents will...

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (08:11)
Mm.

Robert (08:19)
So they go, I'm going to miss you so much on Christmas. That's I'm not going to do anything and I'm going to miss you. And that's wrong. Right.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (08:28)
And it's such a difficult one because as a kid of divorce, think one of the biggest traits that I've developed is empathy and being able to empathize with your parents that of course they're going to miss you on Christmas day. You already know this before they say it, before they have that look on their face, like, please don't go, I'm not saying it, but I just wish I was with my kids all the time of your kids see you, your kids hear you without hearing words.

They know your facial expressions. They understand. And it's, it's important. And I don't think that it's a bad thing to be honest and transparent with your kids. And, know, everybody has emotions and showing them that it's okay to feel. and of course I'm going to miss you, but Hey, I'm so excited for you to go to dad's and go and enjoy yourself because I can't wait for you to get back and we're to have a great time then, but have the best time at dad's. I'll see you when I see you. It's that.

Robert (09:23)
Yeah

Yeah, I think that's so, I think that is so important and, you know, spending holidays away from my, away from my sons at times, it is difficult, but just, I can see that just taking it off of them or they might, and they might call that night dad. was, how was Christmas today? Did you have fun? Yeah, had a great time, even though maybe I didn't, know, whether it's Christmas, New Year's Thanksgiving here in the, in the U S

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (09:24)
there you go.

Robert (09:49)
even though maybe I didn't do anything, maybe I sat there on the couch and read a book all day. Who knows? But just, I think it's time, something like that. It's kind of where us as parents need to just suck it up and leave the kids as hard as it is. And you know, you will get into number five in a minute, but remembering they only have one childhood and let them enjoy it. And I can see as my kids get older.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (09:54)
Mm-hmm.

Robert (10:17)
These Christmases and the excitement of Christmas while it's still there, it's decreasing so much each time. there's still Santa, but you, the whole magic around Santa isn't there. And you know, the gifts are different now than they were before. so yeah, assuring them that you're okay, I think is so important.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (10:38)
It is because...

Robert (10:38)
What anything anything else with that with the assurance?

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (10:42)
Just reminding them that this is, you know, whether it's the school holidays or the fact that they get time off school, like this is your time. This is you've worked hard all term for this and you go enjoy your holidays and let's, let's move away for Christmas from Christmas day for now and think about, the holidays generally, you might just have one week with your kid, or you might have a couple of days with your kid. but you need to remind yourself, Hey, this is their time to see their mates outside of school to do social things as well.

And I need to allow them to do that. and reminding your kids that, Hey, I don't know if you've got anything organized already, which is cool if you do, but if you don't feel free to organize something with your friends, because you know, this is your summer holiday, summer holidays here in Australia. These are your Christmas holidays and you deserve, know, you deserve to be joyous around this time and do what you want to do. And it's not my time. It's your time. And I'm just here and I can't wait for you to get home when you do, but go enjoy yourself.

Robert (11:41)
You've really thought through these. All right. So number three, avoid conflict.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (11:49)
This is a massive one. And I'm unapologetically an advocate for the kid. And, you know, that means sometimes saying things that parents do not want to hear. the fact of this is around holidays and around things like Christmas and really special occasions where, you know, you might have some extra time with your kids or might not be with the kids. It's so important to avoid conflict, of course, but also highly contentious matters. So

Robert (11:49)
Let's hear it.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (12:17)
An example I want to touch on is you might be thinking, okay, say for example, you might have a new partner and that's really great. And we haven't talked about set families yet, but that's a whole nother topic. And that can be a really positive thing, but say it might be a contentious matter in your family. might be a, I haven't, the kids haven't met the partner yet introducing a partner, say for example, which is a really big, significant event.

might not be appropriate for say Christmas day or one of these very special occasions where the focus isn't a circumstance surrounding your separation from their other parent. It's just not something, it's not a time to associate or kids to say like my special occasions, my life, everything surrounds the circumstances surrounding my parent's separation.

and so avoiding those, those highly contentious matters and therefore avoiding conflict just makes the stress easier for the kids. doesn't put another variable into the mix that makes them go, this is a very overwhelming time. And now it's just being made even more overwhelming by conflict or say, for example, at pickup, drop off mom and dad are now fighting about a very highly contentious matter because they want to talk about the school fees, but it's Christmas day.

Robert (13:44)
Yeah. Yeah. So basically for parents, put the boxing gloves down in December. You can pick them back up in January or after the new year, but just put it down and just.

because it's going to eke out. It's going to eat. It's going to it's going to what you're going through is going to eke out to the kids. They're going to feel that. So I think that's a I think that's a great one Bella. Not to run through here, but not to run through it too fast. But number four. All right, help the kids get the co parents of present. I love that. I love that. And I think that's, I think that's so important. Can we talk through that?

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (14:07)
Yeah.

Yeah, I think this is a really niche one. And this is one that parents and co-parents don't really think about too deeply. I remember being very, very young and I think I got some money for a birthday back in the January. And I thought to myself, I've got to keep this until Christmas to make sure that I have money to get mom or dad a present because I don't want to ask mom and dad.

the opposite parent to get a present for the opposite parent because I knew that that would be the last thing that they would want to do. And this was me assuming my parents always, you know, if I were to ask at the time, they would have been like, sure, let's go get a present. That's fine. But my thought pattern wasn't that it was, it wasn't very healthy at all. was, I just want to avoid conflict at all ends. And based on how they talk about each other and based on how they talk to each other.

The last thing that they're going to want to do is help me get each other a present because technically I'm not paying for it. They're paying for it. And I can't imagine dad buying mom a pair of slippers. Like not, not it. and so that was like something that I felt very responsible for, but I pre-planned like literally almost 12 months before, and explicitly telling your kids, Hey, what are you thinking about getting mom for Christmas?

Robert (15:25)
Yeah.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (15:46)
Can I help you? you know, we'll make sure that we on that day that I'm with you, we'll go to the shops. I want to know what you want for Christmas. We can have a look at some of the things that you think you want. We can get your mom a present as well. You know, not making it a big deal of we have to get your mom present because I'm trying to be a really good co-parent. No, it's just we're going to really seamlessly. I'm going to help you out in how you, you know, you want your holiday to go and so that you have something to give.

Robert (16:06)
Right.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (16:16)
your mom or your dad on Christmas day or if their birthday is around the holiday period, same goes. It's just about putting that conflict down and putting down your feelings towards your co-parent and thinking about your kid and what they want to do for their other parent.

Robert (16:33)
I think that's so important. My ex and I, we don't do everything correct in co-parenting, but we have done that. I don't know how she feels, imagine she feels the same way. I think it's so important to take the stress off the kid. We kind of unspokenly have set a budget. Let's say it's, I don't know, for whatever...

occasion it is, whether it's her birthday or Christmas or whatever it may be. And maybe it's a hundred dollars or a hundred fifty dollars or fifty dollars, whatever it is. And now I have two boys and you you have to remind them over and over and over again. And so I'm constantly sending texts about a month out. Hey, you know, it's y'all got to start thinking about presents for your mom for Christmas. And then.

You know, it's a weekly reminder and then it goes to a couple of times a week, three times a week, you know, every day. but I think that is so important and try to just take the stress off them at the same time, Bella. I look at it as they're kind of learning about buying gifts for somebody and you know, and really think through it, not just.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (17:48)
This is true, yes.

Robert (17:53)
Okay. I'm going to get her the red socks. Well, is your mom really going to want red socks? Like think through it, talk to her, find out like, what would you like? You know, what would you need? And, you know, and you really try to be nosy, be inquisitive, try to find out yourself. Like what would your mom like? Like what would make her life easier? What would she, get a pleasure from having from you two? And is it awkward?

Being a parent and buying your ex a gift. Yeah, it is. But I think it's one of those things, Bella where it's not about you. It's about the kids, right?

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (18:30)
That's exactly right. And I think another example I want to touch on to just make this hit home is that when you don't do this, the older sibling, for example, might take on that responsibility and then things start to get ingrained. Like I have to look after my little brother or my little sister to make sure that they don't feel this. So I'm not going to tell even them that I'm getting this present. And then I'm just actually not even going to tell.

dad or mom that I'm getting this present because I just don't want to bring the topic up. And then I'm going to have this really poorly wrap present that I just want to give. But I feel all this pressure and responsibility and I want to protect somebody else from feeling this, you know, by, not doing something, you can also create such a ripple effect that then is ingrained in your kid for, so long. You know, I, we are now adults, my brother and I.

And I still get the bloody present. And it's because I did it all through childhood. He is, but then when I went overseas for a bit, he was like, wait, I have to get the present. I was like, yes, you do. He was like, you've never allowed me to do this. And I realized I took that away from him, but that wasn't my thing to take away from him. That wasn't my pressure to hold or life lesson to teach my brother. That's where the adults have to do the adult thing.

Robert (19:30)
He's smart.

You

Yeah.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (19:56)
and teach the kids what's important. getting someone a present is good life.

Robert (20:00)
We have to put our mess aside and focus on the kids. We do. So, all right, I love that. All right, so number five, I wrote it down. Kids only get one holiday. They only get one Christmas, or not one Christmas, but they only have this holiday one time.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (20:06)
That's it. That's it.

That's it. That's it. Your kids only get one childhood. And if there's anything to guide you through one to four, anything to guide you to putting your conflict down or not, you know, assuring your kids that even though you might be, you know, a little bit unhappy or a bit lonely on those days, it's that your kids only get one childhood. They only get one thing to look back on and think, how did this shape my life? Was it in a positive or was it in a negative way?

Robert (20:22)
Yeah, that's it.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (20:47)
You know, do they now look at Christmas as an adult? Will they look at Christmas as an adult and hate it because they have so much conflict and resentment around this day, which is supposed to be such a joyous, happy day. That is the fact your kids only get, you only get one kind of chance to shape what these things look like, looks like for your kids. And it is in your control to do numbers one to four.

It is in your control and you have the ability, no matter how difficult your co-parenting relationship is, if you put your kids first and you put them at the forefront, then you can make sure that that one childhood is a positive experience for your kids.

Robert (21:31)
love that. And I was talking to somebody not too long ago, about a month ago. We were talking about Christmas and they were telling me, yeah, I'm just, I just don't really get into Christmas much. And so I, you know, it's like, really? And they're like, yeah, I just, you know, I started digging further and further. And it comes back to all the conflict when they were being raised and their parents, I asked him, like, did your parents realize that? Like, no, no. But it was just how

It was just full of chaos Christmas was. And so now it's hard. They never experienced kind of the magic or the joyousness around Christmas. And it's hard for them to really go there. And if anything, they're just kind of like, ugh, Christmas. Because that brings back awful memories for them. And that's sad. And you don't want that to be for your kids.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (22:21)
You don't. And that's a reality. I told you about that pick up drop off place we always had on Christmas day. It was such an exciting time to go to dad, but it was such a sad time to be leaving mom. And I actually hate driving past it because I'm like, ugh, that's just so many emotions there. And that's okay. That was unavoidable. But if it was different, and I thought every time we went to that place, there was a massive blow up. I don't even know if I'd go on that road.

Robert (22:50)
No. Yeah.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (22:51)
You know, these are the, these are the literal impacts that your actions can have on your kids. And it's one childhood that they will, they will grow up and they will remember and they will know, you know, and it will shape how they view really important things in their lives.

Robert (23:07)
Bella, this is very, very well thought through. I appreciate you doing that. If you're going to give anything else that kind of comes to mind.

Besides be the grown up, be the parent, be... Put all your shit aside and just...

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (23:20)
Yeah, keep the... That's it, honestly. I think especially during this time, keep the adult talk between the adults and really pick and choose what is necessary around this time. You know, talking about something that, you know, can wait for the new year, can wait till the kids go back to school. You know, put it on hold if that, you know, is more beneficial to your kids. Be the grown up, keep the adult talk between the adults.

because it's not your kid's responsibility. especially around this time, everybody is very highly emotional in a positive and sometimes in a more negative way. So it's really important to be mindful of that. But again, keep that North Star of your kid only gets one childhood and we need to put the kids first. And that's irrespective of your relationship with your co-parent.

Robert (24:13)
I love it. You're such an expert and I appreciate you. You know, I want to do this and you were the first one that came to mind and I'm like, I don't know if she'll do it, but man, I hope she will. And I just, thank you so much for agreeing to come back on. I definitely do. And I just think, you know, all that you provide is so valuable to parents and I'm sure other ones listening or getting a ton of value from you. How you've said it before, but how can people find you?

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (24:41)
Of course. So you can find me at www.akidwithtwohomes.com. It's a blog, but it also has some really helpful resources for co-parents as well as children on there just to know that you're not alone, that you're seen, heard. That's the whole point of A Kid with Two Homes, but you can also find me on Instagram at akidwithtwohomes.tw0.2.

Robert (25:03)
Yeah. And I'm glad you said that because it's not just for co-parents. I mean, there's a lot of valuable information on there for kids that have been a part of or am a part of a divorced home. You know, parents that are separated, whatever it may be, it's valuable. There's a lot of value for both in there. So I'm glad you mention that. Bella.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (25:26)
Thanks so much, Robert.

Robert (25:31)
No, go ahead.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (25:33)
No, no, was just saying it's, I think what I'm doing is what I needed when I was growing up and I wish I had something to read. So specifically that blog and the Instagram, it is very much what I wish I could, I could have found out there when I was a kid.

Robert (25:47)
Yeah, but now you're sharing it to save so to help so many others and I mean, you're paying it forward, you know, unfortunately, you had to go through it, but you're helping others and you know, we were talking about before I mean, you know, we are sharing a story with you somebody before that you're able to help them and it's it's amazing what you're doing and I just I thank you and I thank you for taking the time out and coming on from Australia and it's still when you said summer for Christmas, it's like what

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (26:15)
Yeah. I can't imagine anything different. That's the, that's the crazy thing we live on opposite sides of the world. And yeah, it's always a bloody hot day here on Christmas day. yeah, it's great.

Robert (26:16)
It's hard to imagine that.

Yeah, that's amazing. It's hard to imagine that, know, because we think of cold and the fireplace and hopefully snow and, you know, and all of that. But that's quite the opposite for you guys. Your shorts. Yeah.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (26:36)
I know.

quite the opposite. It's not like the movies. This is the thing. We see all the movies, everyone's rung up and I was actually very fortunate enough to actually spend Christmas last year in the States in New York and it was just amazing. We were like, okay, this is like the movies. This is maybe what Christmas is supposed to be, but we're used to the bloody hot and doing these ones in the car.

Robert (26:54)
wow, it is. Yeah.

Yeah. Did you get to get a Rockefeller center as well? Did you get to get a Rockefeller center with the ice skating? Yeah. It's at such a magical place during this time of year. It really is. Well, Bella, look, I don't want to keep you, but thank you so much for coming on. Okay. Thank you. And if we have any other questions, you know, you're my go-to and I'm gonna reach back out, but thank you for coming back on. Okay. And I look, and I hope you all have a great holiday season as well. So.

Bella - A Kid With Two Homes (27:06)
Yeah, it was amazing. It was amazing. So cool.

It is, honestly.

course. Thanks so much for having me Robert.

Robert (27:31)
Hey, and thank you all for listening to Dad to Dad's podcast. You can find us on Spotify or Instagram as well as on YouTube. Don't forget to hit the like and subscribe button and feel free to leave a comment. I read every comment and find them at least most of them pretty valuable. I love when there's show suggestions in there as well. And just thank you all and we will talk to you next time.