A Parent's Worst Nightmare: Matt & Monica Spellicy

In this deeply emotional and raw episode of the Dad to Dads podcast, Robert sits down with Matt and Monica Spellicy for a conversation that explores the unimaginable journey of losing two children in a tragic accident.

When Matt and Monica’s lives were shattered in July 2025 by a devastating tractor-trailer collision that claimed the lives of Matt’s oldest son, Tyler, and his daughter, Kylie, they were forced to navigate a depth of grief that no parent should ever have to face. Yet, in the wake of this heartbreak, they have chosen to stand firm in their faith and purpose.

In this episode, we discuss:

• Surviving the Unthinkable: How Matt and Monica have navigated the immediate aftermath of losing Tyler and Kylie, and the role their faith has played in keeping them upright.
• The Power of Memory: Matt shares tender, authentic stories about Tyler’s growth and Kylie’s spirit, explaining why he chooses to lean into the pain rather than hide from it.
• Parenting After Tragedy: A profound look at how they continue to parent their youngest son, Bradley, and why they are committed to showing him and others that you can find happiness again after loss.
• The Choice to Be Better: Why Matt believes that even in the darkest moments, we have a choice: to be broken by our adversity or to use it to become stronger for ourselves and our families.

This conversation is not just about grief; it is a masterclass in courage, intentional parenting, and the healing power of vulnerability. If you have experienced a profound loss, or if you simply need a reminder to cherish the time you have with your children, this episode is for you.

Connect with Matt & Monica:

• Website: thematamonicapodcast.com
• Find them on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube.

Connect with Dad to Dads:

• https://www.instagram.com/dadtodads/

Don’t forget to LIKE, SUBSCRIBE, and feel free to leave us a COMMENT

#GriefAndHealing #ParentingThroughAdversity #FaithInHardTimes #Resilience #InspiringStories #OvercomingLoss #MentalHealthAwareness #FamilyFirst #MovingForward #parenting #faith #loss #fatherhood #grief

Transcript

0:00

Matt and Monica Spelessy, welcome to the Daddy Dads podcast. Hey, thanks for having us on. Thank you. Appreciate you guys coming on. Matt, you know, I know we spoke um might have been a couple weeks ago, and you'd reached out and I what I thought was gonna be like a five, ten minute conversation turned into a rather lengthy conversation when we started digging into your story. And you know, I wanted to have you guys on. As we were talking about before we recorded, you guys have experienced something that unfortunately it's most parents worst nightmare. And you guys have been through it, you're going through it. Um there's you know what I was impressed with was your courage and your resiliency. And I just again, one I want to tell you I'm sorry. But two, just um thank you for taking time out of your afternoon for coming on. Of course, I appreciate you having us here, man. One of the reasons why we have Matt and Monica on um is because you you guys have a podcast too, the Matt and Monica podcast, and we want to talk about that, but also just want to go through your story if you don't mind. Yeah, and if you would kind of keep us on rails, especially me. I have uh I get caught on tangents every four seconds. That's fine. That's fine. We'll need to reel it back in, don't hesitate. I'll get you back and Monica can punch you. Yeah, I just like kind of be like, all right, that's good. There you go. But um, yeah, man, we uh we met um in 2016. Um I was in the army, I was at Fort Drum, and we you know, I was uh shortly out of a long-term relationship, so I was living in my parents' basement. She was living in her parents' basement, and I'm like, I'm a loser with three kids living in my parents' basement, got nothing really going for me. Who is gonna who am I gonna find? Yeah, I felt like that too though. Yeah, and um and we actually we talked about that in the beginning of our when we started our podcast, which I'll we'll get to in a bit, but uh Yeah, but we gotta see how we met. Because everyone kind of giggles. We left uh we met off of Tinder. Yeah. Oh wow, very interesting, right? Yeah, so an actual relationship and not a hookup uh relationship. Yep. That's that that is amazing. Wow, congratulations. Thanks. I I owe Tinder. Yeah, you know. But uh yeah, man, we and we've always had this relationship, whereas um, you know, and I know that I'm sure there's a lot of people that say this, but we really we get along incredibly well. And uh and a lot of times I I tell people I don't know what I did right in this world to deserve her. But um, you know, especially especially navigating hard times, I realized, I mean, I've I don't know how many times I looked at her, I'm just like, there's nothing I'd change about you. And um, you know, I'm I'm very blessed, regardless of what we've gone through and the losses that we've um went through. I'm I'm so fortunate. So Ray. Our relationship is so like we are each other's best friend and we love being together. You know, I know a lot of couples that are like, I need a break from my wife or husband. And I'm like, no, I want to hang out with you every day. Um, so that's you know, it's still like the honeymoon phase, like even after 10 years, and you know, we do have our ups and downs, and you know, we bicker sometimes, but we sure we talk, you know, and we put our love first, not the problem first. And that I think a lot of times um for most people it's kind of hard for them in a relationship because they focus on the problem, especially when you're co-parenting. Um, you know, I have three three children, I should say I had three children with my ex-wife, and she has you know, we have I have two stepdaughters, full-time. I have my we have our stepdaughters, which they just get into the age of moving out and stuff, you know, going to college. But um in in as far as like careers, I I was in the Army Reserve for eight years and working in IT as a cybersecurity engineer. And um Yeah, I work um at an elementary school, uh pre-K to fourth grade, which I'm normally in fourth grade, so it's pretty uh crazy days for me every day. Well, what do you do? What do you do with elementary school? I'm a TA. I kind of have a one-on-one, but I go in the third grade, I'll go to second grade, so you know, wherever they need me. That's great, and thank you. I cannot imagine being a teacher today. Yeah, that's a whole don't get it. That's that's a whole that's a whole other podcast. It really is. It is for sure. And and Matt, thank you for your service too. I mean, cybersecurity, I mean, that is a whole other podcast. I would love to just it's a subject that we don't get into, but I would love to pick your brain on that because that's that's crazy in of itself. And uh look, I I appreciate you guys taking time out again. And um I just I don't know. Let's dive in. Do you mind kind of giving me the background and and really I I almost wish we could have recorded our initial conversation. I know. I thought about that too, man. And and you know, uh that's why when I when I talked to somebody the first time, I I really like to keep it to about five minutes, but I feel like you and I just kind of clicked and we, you know, both were talking so much and you know, time passed, and I'm like, oh my gosh, I wish I had recorded that. But if you don't mind just kind of going through going through and and um you know telling me everything. Okay. Um I think the first part I think would be appropriate to start um to keep this under you know 10 hours long, um, would be the why. The why, why we started the podcast, um, why we're doing what we're doing, because um, you know, our entire premise of doing what we're doing has essentially been or has turned into rather um to show people, regardless of what you go through in life, you have no excuse. You have no excuse to give up, you have no excuse to go down a path to drugs, alcohol, you have no excuse to be a shitty person to other people. And um in when we first started the podcast, we were going through a lot. We're going through a custody battle with my ex-wife, and um, you know, and then there's a there's a lot to unpack there. I can't really go too much into detail um comfortably. Yeah. But um, it was it was dark, and there's a lot of people that don't understand um I didn't understand until I had to navigate you know family court and stuff firsthand. Just when I say flawed system, that there's there's no words that could explain how flawed it is. And um we navigated that for a little over two years. And um, you know, and this was my ex-wife and I, we were sit we were split up for years, um probably close to ten years we were we were separated, split up, divorce, you name it. And um, you know, things just changed. About a year into the um the custody battle, I'll say, Um, things were things were dark. I mean, I was at a place where I just I couldn't believe I couldn't believe a, you know, how much of a system could fail somebody, but more more importantly, like I was I was not at a good place in my own head. I mean, I was I was concerned for my own well-being in a lot of ways, just like, you know, I wasn't suicidal, but I was just I was going through so much stuff being worried, um, anxious about my kids and stuff for such a long period of time. Whereas I just I I remember being in bed one time and I was crying about something at this point in time, and she's like, you know, I'm I'm worried about the kids, but I'm I'm more worried about you right now. And um, and I I don't think I told you this last time we talked, but I actually went to the VA and like checked myself in for an evaluation. And again, it wasn't because I was suicidal, I wasn't losing my mind, I was just like, I was concerned for my own, like I I never went through so much stress, I guess. And um, which there's a whole story up like I can go off on that, but um, and I ended up having the person that I saw there that um talked to me, and he essentially said, Hey, like, you're doing all the right things, you're just going through a lot, and which was probably what I needed to hear. I was really worried that he's gonna try to like throw prescriptions at me. Right. I'm I'm very uh anti-pharmaceuticals, you know, teach their own, but for me personally, I just I didn't want to go that route. Yeah. And um, and uh I remember um at this point in my life, I was at such a rock bottom that I actually decided to try going back to church. When I say going back, um we I never went since I was probably 16, 17 years old. So this is 20 years, give or take, where I haven't been to church. And um and I've always maintained um a faith-based life for the most part. But um as I think a lot of people do, it took me hitting hitting rock bottom to get my butt back in there just to just reaching for something. And um, and I'm I'm beyond grateful that I did. And um and feel free, just nudge me if you want to slip something in because I don't want to. Go ahead. Okay, I will, don't worry, I'll like intervene at some point. So at this point, I mean things were really bad. I you know, we're we're navigating a whole bunch of stuff. Um this and I say to people, when you're going through adversity, you know, like whether it's someone who's sick with a disease or um when you when you if you lose somebody, like it that's all difficult. But when you're going through adversity, that's completely avoidable. And what I mean by that is it's it's completely avoidable to the point if if somebody were to step in and look at the situation, analyze the situation, and be like, hey, this is morally not right, we're gonna fix it, we're gonna move, we're gonna change the situation. It's just it's hard to um phrase it without really going too far into detail. But and I remember at this point, I started bringing my kids to church as well, and I remember telling my um my 12-year-old, he he would have been 10 at the time. And I remember saying to him, I'm like, hey buddy, I'm like, just so you know, like church can help anybody going through a hard time, anyone. And um, because and I I was implying something there when I was saying that to him. And um, lo and behold, the next week we go to church with our family, and my ex-wife was at our church, and I was like, shh, you know, of course, I'm like, shit, I didn't want to go to my church, you know. And uh out of all the churches, right? And um, and it was like it was it was it was a lot to digest because there was there was a lot of animosity there for a long time. And um, I remember that day leaving the church, we're in the car, it was quiet. You know, she's you know, she's bent, um, and we're just like, we're just trying to digest it. And then um ultimately, uh, you know, and I think this is the right way to look at it, it it took a lot to get there, but I was just like, best case scenario, you know, uh you know, if she's looking for something that she's looking for faith, and she because she's struggling to, um she finds God it could help her as well. And um so lo and behold, she started going to church on a pretty regular basis and stuff, and um, we continue down that path. And um fast forward to um spring of 2025, so this is about six months to a year or maybe we need to back up a little bit just to make a little bit more detail so people know. Um, like we would bring our kids to church, but his old his oldest daughter, she wasn't living with us and wasn't at our house for like the two years of the custody battle. Okay, so we haven't really still 50-50. That is a that is a key point. Because like so I was battling, you know, I've always been very close to my kids, then when you get my oldest daughter, I just want to stay at mom's house because you know she was doing her own thing. And um, you know, we I have pretty I don't want to say strict, I have pretty understandable rules, but I'm very if I have a rule like hey, no vapes in the house, right? No smoking, no drinking, like that's that's my rule. I'm not gonna that's not malleable, you know. I'm I'm not changing anything. Right, right. You reinforce those. Yeah. Right. And within those, you know, two years or so when we didn't have her here, we began missing her already. Oh yeah. You know, so that was just a huge chunk of the pain of her just not ever coming here or seeing it. Was she going to church? Was she going to she was not going to church? She went one time. Yeah. Okay. You're right. Yeah. Um, so that and like my daughter for those two years was kind of like the crux of my adversity. I was worried sick about her. My boys, however, you know, I still had 50-50 custody throughout the entire thing. And um, they deemed she was too old if they if I were if they were to have tried to force her to continue to you know switch houses at 16-17. I guess it was considered like a flight risk scenario where you know things would get worse. Yeah, which as much as I didn't like it, I I did understand that. So um, yeah, in spring, uh April time frame, all the animosity with with my ex-wife and between us, it just it was gone. And um, she was regularly, you know, we would see her at church and stuff and we'd interact and we'd even like stand in like like kind of like semicircles after the episode. Okay, so so it was a it was a good enough relationship where you guys could talk and at this point, at this point. If if people knew the details of the past, they'd be like, what is happening? This is really weird, you know. So it was a big step, I feel like, in the right direction for healing for us to even be able to be in like a circle and just talk. Yeah. Out of uh after two years of going through custody battle and everything else. That's that's that's amazing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um so again, that was an April time frame, and then uh we actually we went to at the end of May, we had a court, um, another court hearing, which was like I mean, we've been to countless and nothing over the two years, there was literally nothing that's ever happened. I mean, nothing changed, no orders, nothing. They didn't even ever try to have us mediate to see if we would mediate, which I thought was really strange, also. And because I I asked about it. And um, well, in the beginning they did. Like right at the beginning. Um and uh so at the end of May we sat in the we go to court, we go into this waiting room, which is normally it's a pretty large waiting room, it's normally full of people, it's weird. It was almost like it was like meant to be like divine. It was just her, Monica, myself, and the the security guard in front of us, and we were sitting there kind of quiet for a while, and then somehow I don't really recall what the conversation was. I think you broke the ice. I usually you do that. Yeah, it was just small talk happened. And then which Natasha and I, you know, we've we've talked here and there back and forth, but at this point, it was like even Monica and her were talking. I was like, holy shit, you know, this is everyone's like, let this happen, don't say anything, just let them talk. Yeah, yeah. And uh, and right right after we were done talking for like 15-20 minutes or whatever, I saw my attorney, he comes in and her attorney comes in. I said something to my attorney, I'm like, hey, I'm like, are we able to see if she's willing to just I'm like, I'm just done with this. I'm done with this court thing. And and um sure enough, we end up settling right out of court like that day. We just it was it just everything was dropped, and um, which wasn't easy. Um but you know, you I've I've heard the phrase my whole life and it's never meant so much until I guess the last couple years, the power of forgiveness. And yeah um, and and like we always say, like forgiveness doesn't it doesn't mean you forget everything that's happened, but you're able to just be above that and um let it go. It's out of your control. It's so tough though, especially when especially when kids are involved. Like you know, I know for me personally, like I can um it's easier to forgive somebody when they've done something that hurts me. I mean I just I kind of for you know, I forgive them and I forget them. I forget the person. Yeah, I mean literally. Um but when it's something to my kids, it's different. It's like a different it takes a different level of forgiveness for that. That's tough. Yep, it is, and I agree. Yeah. All right, sorry, go ahead. No, you're good. Um so you know, I we were in it was June of last summer, and I was just I remember saying to her, I'm like, everything, every all of my adversity is gone. Everybody I love and care about is healthy. Um I'm not concerned about anyone. My daughter seemed she was doing better. Um and um actually it was the so July 17th was the the difficult day, but the week prior to July 17th, um I picked up my daughter and my boys from her mom's, which it was, you know, it was like a weekend when I normally pick up the boys, but I picked up my daughter as well, which was unheard of. You know, this is the first time in I think on a regular like Friday when I would pick them up that she wanted to go with me. And um, we I went and some it sounds so like simple, but I'll never forget this day the rest of my life. Um we went down to a grocery store and got like a giant sub and brought it back to my mom and dad's house and we enjoyed a little dinner together. And you know, you know what's crazy, man? It's like I've talked about this a lot, and a lot of times I don't get emotional. And I'm I but I'm also sitting next to uh I got a photo collage over here in my garage in front of where I work out of from the funeral of all my daughter here and then my my son here. So this is different for me, but maybe it's a good thing. There you go. But um, take as much time as you need, and look, you you've you've got your best support staff right next to you. So exactly. Um so that Friday we pick up my daughter, I and we brought her down. I brought the um the boys and my daughter down to this river just to, you know, I've I've always been a pretty random dad where I'd just we'd go next to the river and just stand there and talk sometimes, throw rocks. And um, we we tried to do that, but the mosquitoes were so damn bad we were outside of my truck for like five minutes. We're like, all right, screw this. We got back in my truck, and then we end up um right down the road, there was this um this lady, an old older lady from she goes to my church and she's a good friend of ours now. Um I knew she lived a quarter mile down the road, so we decided to stop there because she knew everything about like what we've been through and stuff. So I decided I wanted I really wanted to introduce her to my daughter when she saw us come up to her house with all three of my kids, she knew the significance behind it. Yeah, and um, you know, she giving my daughter a hug like crazy and my boys too, and um, it was it was pretty cool. So uh end up dropping her off back at her mom's, and I think um myself and the boys went went and you know had our weekend or whatever. And um Sunday, Sunday at church, again, this is the Sunday before the accident. Um we were sitting at church, we went with my my late son Tyler, my 16-year-old, and my my youngest was at a friend's house, so he wasn't there unfortunately. But we uh we go into church like we normally do. It was just myself, Monica, and Tyler, and then um this the services started, and like just a couple minutes in, my ex-wife comes in. I think she hugged my son and she went over to like the other aisle. Because like we were amicable, we never like sat together, you know. We it just we weren't there yet, I guess. Yeah. But um, we asked her if even if you were, that'd be kind of odd. I mean, I just I agree definitely that that would never happen, but sitting between your wife and your ex-wife out. Yeah, yeah. But we did um we did ask her if she wanted to like sit, like she came over and sat on the other side of my son Tyler. And um, which we felt like it was the right thing to do for some reason, like that that day we were just like we kind of like looked at each other and didn't really say anything. We just knew what we should do. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And we just felt like it was well. Um like it was just a it was a massive milestone, I guess, in the right step in the right direction. Then like a huge another healing stone, like you know, like just another jump. Way to move forward. Yeah. Yeah, and two Tuesday night, um, we ended up she ended up coming over. I well, I called her up and I told her how I grounded my son from his cell phone and he's been talking back and stuff. So we actually decided to co-parent, which is you know, it was great because that's how it's it was for so long. And she actually came over to our house. We sat underneath the gazebo with my my 16-year-old, and we were talking to him about his attitude and stuff, which wasn't really that bad. It's pretty typical teenager stuff. However, yeah, it was nice for like for him to see mom and dad on the same page together, yeah. Yeah, together working working together to parent to parent him. Right. Yeah, and then she ended up leaving. Then um, he ended up walking down to go swimming in the lake with my son and I and my dog. My my so my 12-year-old, my 16-year-old, and myself and my dog walked down there. And it was funny because we had, since he was grounded off of his phone, we actually spent some good quality time together. Isn't that amazing when they put the phones down? Though it's just weird because during the I think it was like two or three days, I had vertigo really, really bad. Yeah. Right? And then that's why I didn't go down to have the conversation because I like couldn't even get out of bed. I didn't walk down to the water. But um he told me about the conversation, but he stayed home that day because he was worried that I was like, I don't know what was gonna happen, but um you can go on. That was the next day, but it was the next day, it was Wednesday. Anyway, that's when okay. She mixes everything up. Yeah, I'm just kidding. My brain is like that. But yeah, so we we ended up going down to the water and going for a swim, and um it was it was it was such a beautiful night, you know. And then I took some pictures and stuff, thank God. And um my my youngest said, Tyler, I like you better when you're grounded. You actually play with me. And my my kids were pretty good about doing the outdoorsy stuff and kind of balancing. However, my 16 year old had a girlfriend at this point. For you know, and it was getting pretty serious. So I mean they're on the phones all the time talking. Yeah. And um that are snapping each other. Yeah. I don't even know if they do talk anymore. I think they just snap one another all the time. Yeah. Yep. So um then we we get into July 17th, 2025. And um, yeah, I was at work, um, I and sitting at my desk on my computer, and um my my ex-wife was taking my boys and my and my daughter camping. I end up getting a text message from my youngest, and it was a picture of a Porsche, and he was in the car. He's like, Dad, look, you know, he loves cars. Yeah. And then like an hour and a half later, it was about four, a little after four o'clock, I get a phone call from my son. I'm like, I'm still sitting at my desk at work. I'm like, he knows I'm working, but I answer and he's frantic. He's like, Dad, there's been a really bad accident, they can't get mom out of the car. And I'm like, hold on, hold on. And I couldn't really understand him too well. I'm like, hold on, I'm listening to me. I'm like, you need to you need to take three deep breaths and then try talking to me. And he I mean, he was spot on. He listened to everything I said. He's like, Dad, there's been an accident, it's it's really, really bad. They can't get mom out of the car. And um, I start freaking out. And now at this point, I didn't know who was in the car, I knew no details. Right. And um, so I'm like, I need you to find out where you are right now. And he's like, I don't know where I am, I don't know where I am, and I'm like, open up your phone, open up your GPS, tell me the the closest roads, and I end up finding out where he is, hour and 15 minutes from where I work. So um I'm I jump in my truck, I call her, I put her on my um I had a work phone, so I put that, and like I told her, I'm like, I don't know what's going on, I'll let you listen in, please don't talk. Just I'll I want you to be aware. So I set that phone down so she could. So I got my son through my truck speakers in um and I'm driving, and then I I I don't remember exactly how this in what order, but essentially um at some point he told me um that oh no, and I asked him who who else is in the car, and he said Kylie and Tyler. And then I'm like, okay. And I'm like thinking, I'm telling myself, I'm like, he's he's 11 years old at the no, he just turned 12. Yeah, he's 12 years old, he's probably exaggerating, you know, he doesn't know. You know, I'm telling myself it's not that bad, everything's fine. And then he said something about a helicopter, and as soon as he said something about somebody being medevact, I I knew, you know, because I have former law enforcement as well. And um and I I asked him, I'm like, I asked him something, some sort of detail about the accident, and then he said, Well, it was a truck. I'm like, what do you mean, truck? He's like, a tractor trailer. I'm like, No, and I'm just like, this, you know, I this can't be happening, you know, and um it is weird. My mind went in like this place where I was like, I went super serious, I just kept driving, and then I mean, I I I've said this a couple different times. When you're when you're driving somewhere and you got your four-ways on and you're trying to honk people out of the way, it's it's stupidly ineffective. Like, I mean, I was passing people and places I shouldn't be passing people. I almost got in a head-on collision on in route to the accident. I mean, it was it was close, and you know, thank god I freaking didn't, but uh I end up getting I I pull up to where the accident was at this intersection, and um I parked probably a hundred yards or so away from it just because there was a lot of commotion going on. I mean there was cops everywhere and um EMT services and stuff, and I'm jogging up to where I saw like where it looked like the police officers were talking to people and self-assuming, because I just wanted to get to my son. That's all I could think about. And um and I uh right as I'm walk running up, I hear my um my ex-sister-in-law just screaming, no, they're gone, they're gone. And like I can. I heard that on the phone too. Yeah, and like I can oh, it's weird. I can I can hear that in my head just talking to you. But um, so I I get close as I'm like jogging up, I like kind of like grab my son, and I don't know if as I grab him or not, but they told me um they didn't make it, and they said my 16-year-old son Tyler didn't make it, and um my ex-wife didn't make it, and my daughter just was being airlifted to the hospital. And uh and um I remember at this point there was one officer there. I there's there's probably like six deputies standing in a line with the um Lewis County Sheriff, and there's one on the far left, and he just look like the the his look on his face tore through my soul, and he just you know he looked like he he was crushed. And um, which I gotta I gotta remember to get back to that because it's relevant. Um a few months later I end up talking to that guy. But um so I grabbed my son and like dude, I you can't even make this up. The second they told me, the second they told me that they didn't make it, it was like a crack of rain. It just started downpouring out of nowhere. It was like it was if it seemed like it was out of a movie or something. And um, so I ended up jumping in the back of my truck, and there was a Lewis County traumatic loss, like um non-profit, a lady that like they show up to accents like this to try to like help the family. And um, so like Bradley, myself, and this some lady, I I couldn't tell you what she looked like. We get in the back of my truck, and she's like handing my son like a stuffed animal in a book, like collaring books and stuff, and and like he was like we were in shock, you know what I mean? Like, and he was taking this stuff and like holding it like kind of like he was almost like pretending that he cared about that right there. I mean, he just found out his mom passed away. He didn't care about the stuffed animal, he didn't care about any of that, but he was being respectful to this lady, and um I don't know how much longer I stayed there, it couldn't have been maybe two or three minutes, but I ended up getting into my truck with my son. We ended up going back to pick her up on the way to the hospital where my daughter's being airlifted. And um, and I I don't know if I'm at that time you knew you knew that your oldest son Tyler and your ex-wife were no longer with you, and Kylie, your daughter, you knew she had been basically lifeline. Can I can I stop you for a minute and with your youngest Brad Bradley, correct? Yeah. I know, but what those listening, he was not in the car with them. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Can you go back and can can you kind of go through that and place him where he is, why he wasn't in that car as well? Yeah, so so he was in um an uh a lead vehicle that they're following each other, two vehicles going to camp. Um the lead vehicle went through the intersection while Natasha's vehicle drove through and got hit on the left-hand side by a tractor trailer at a bad intersection. Now there were also three dogs in the car that got killed. And um the three dogs, I say, you know, it's unfortunate that they died, but because those three dogs were in the car, my son and Natasha asked Bradley to ride with his Aunt Jen, I guess. So it's like talk about a blessing in disguise because it's just uh, you know, but um I mean either way, it's just it's it it makes the whole situation even more. It's not only did he lose his mom, brother, and sister, he lost his mom, brother, sister, and his three dogs. So it's like and um but uh And did what was there a s at the accident scene, was there a stop sign, stoplight? Was it Yeah, it's it was one of those blink it was a it's a major highway where they had a they it was a um it was it red this way red this way blinking yellow. They've since changed it. They actually changed it in like I guess for for a state route to be changed within two weeks is like absolutely unheard of just from a motor vehicle accident, but they actually changed this one pretty much. Did she go through the red? Was that what it was? Or from I I think what it was is like it was like stop and go, then she just probably assumed that person's gotta stop, stop, and she went. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I say like I've I've done stuff like that many times. Yeah, all the time. Yeah. It that that intersection is known to have a lot of accidents and too many fatalities. So they should have fixed that intersection a long time ago, but yeah. So um, but one of the one of the key things was um we were we were driving away from the scene. This is minutes after what was what we just found out, and you could still see like the the emergency vehicles in the rear view mirror and stuff, and um, you know, I had tears coming down my face, but I wasn't like I I was in shock, you know. Same thing with Brad. Like, and uh he reaches over and he grabs my hand and his his little hand in my hand and he's like, Dad, uh, he's like, We're gonna be happy again, I promise. And then the other thing he asked me, like, it was maybe like 20, 30 seconds after, he's like, Dad, he's like, could something like this make is this something that a lot of what do you say? He's like, this is would this make people hate Jesus? You know, and I I still to this day really don't know where that question came up at that exact point in time, but he he said no. He's like he's like, I I love him even more, is what he said. And I still don't know his choice of words at that moment, don't understand completely however like uh it's uh it's a it's amazing, and I can't go into it either. Um but it there's it's amazing what kids will say at certain times. And when you question them on that, whether it's months later and even years later, they don't even know where it came from. They don't know where it came from, and sometimes sometimes it's I don't even remember saying that. And I tend to think it's some somebody else speaking through them, you know, or something else. I I tend to think that. So I just it's crazy that his first thought getting in the truck with me is to console me, like to hey dad, everything's gonna be okay. Like, what what were what what were you thinking during that time if you don't mind sharing? Like I I can't and if you don't want to go there, that's fine. No, no, you but I I can't imagine that as a dad. I mean, where you hey, I've got to get to Kylie, I've got to see what's going on. You you know you just lost you just lost your oldest son, Tyler. Yeah. You know, you also lost your ex-wife, you know, that you had spent, no matter what the relationship had been, you spent a lot of time with her, had three kids together. So there's been you know there's been those two losses in your life. You have somebody else that potentially there could be a loss, you know, they're at the hospital or on their way to the hospital, and then you've got your you've got your son Bradley, who's okay. Like, what what is do you even remember? There's so many there's so many dynamics of pain there because it's like yeah, like Tyler, Tyler's, dude, he was he this kid is my best friend, like, oh and um, but even I I don't know what's more of a a a pain point, like Natasha loved Bradley so much, and Bradley loved his mom, dude. He was he was worried about her on and off, and like he was worried about something happening to her in her car. And I remember him often just just wanting to talk to her, make sure she's okay and stuff. But it's like, yeah, and like it my mind didn't know what the fuck, excuse my language, to do with anything. It was it was going in a thousand different directions. It doesn't know whether or not to even believe this is reality. Like, I mean, I've had some bad nightmares in my life, like this exceeded any nightmare I've ever had my entire life. I've never dreamt anything this bad. So it's like, how do you process that? And I I don't know if I even still have fully. It's just, you know, like yeah, we I went and we picked her up, we go to the hospital, and then you know, seeing my daughter the way she was in the ICU, and then people don't even think about things like what's it like being a father going through unheard of tragedy like that. Then you gotta go home. Yeah. Not only do you have to go home, you have to go home with your your son that like it's like I don't know if I hurt more for myself or if I'm worried about his pain or if I'm and um you know, and I walk into my house and you know, I got that bunk bed that he shares with his brother. You know, so I'm like, he's he ended up sleeping with us for a few nights. Or I'm like, you know, I and um you know, we and we got pictures all around the house. I got my son's I remember thinking about his toothbrush, the trampoline in the backyard. Like I think about all these things. Well, it's such little things that we haven't even touched. Um, like his loofah is still in the shower. Yeah. I haven't touched that. Oh, it's still there. It's still there. It is. I probably won't touch it for a very long time. Yeah. But there will be those things you find too, right? You'll find something under the bed or where wherever, in the closet that yeah, you know, it's I look at pictures all the time. You know, I got them on my dash, on my truck, I got them, I got I got pictures everywhere. I I want to talk about them. I want to remember them, I want to think about it. If it hurts, I want it to hurt, man. My logic is like if the hurt starts to go away when I think about them, it's like maybe the memory's starting to fade. So I I don't want that. But and the flip side of it, you get like the it's kind of a new thing in this day and age. Like so 20 years ago, if somebody went through something like this, 20 years ago you didn't have a Google Cloud or Apple Cloud of all these photos that are sending your reminders every day of what's gone. And it's you know, nobody knows of what that does to somebody's grieving process. I don't know. And I'm I'm grateful I have all these photos and memories, but I'm just like it, I I don't know if it's good for me necessarily. You know, I'd rather if if I had to choose, I'd rather have these memories, otherwise I could delete everything. But um, it's just it's weird. And um, but uh going back to kind of like the timeline, um you know, we we went to the hospital. My daughter was she was in the ICU for three weeks, and it's like I couldn't even grieve for the extreme loss that I already lost with my daughter is you know, we're we're going to upstate to see her, and and like I never been in a situation like that where I'm praying for somebody, praying to God, A, they hear me. You know, they say sometimes they think people can hear when they're in in a coma and stuff like that, and I'm you know, I'm talking to her and like like telling your little girl that you love her when she's in the hospital like that. Like I there's no words that can explain, you know. And I I can I can as I'm saying this, I can still like remember like holding her hand. Literally was just thinking that. You know, which she just got a tattoo on because she turned second she turned 18, she got tattoos, she got butterfly tattoos on her hand, which actually looked pr pretty cute, I guess. But um that would be Kylie. Oh man. You know, I I tend to believe and from things you read with people in interviews I've seen with people that have been in a coma and and and been in different situations when they've been under, and those even that they talk about having afterlife experiences and then coming back. They know what's going on in the room. Yeah, they hear people. So, you know, I can't tell you for sure, but from those people, I guarantee you, or I can just about guarantee you she heard everything you said, saw every tear, and took everything in. You know? It's just really weird to like like when everything was happening from like the call of the accident, even to like right now, like at this moment, it's weird. Like I am in denial still most of the time. Sure you are and I think that's like a protective thing for my brain because I feel like I would just like lose it. You know, like we still have you know our other three kids that we need to take care of and be there and be mentally healthy to take care of them and stuff and show them that they can get through hard things too. And if we can get through this hard thing, like this is one of the hardest hard things that anyone can go through. And something nobody nobody should go through. I wanna I wanna go back but before we go for it. Why why do you think Kylie came that day? What what do you what do you why wh why do you think it was? Did you ask her to? Was it just like, hey, I'm a like why I why do you think I don't I don't know. That's that's a great question. You know, I I can I can maybe it was divine. I I don't know. Um I don't recall if like I probably did extend the invite, um, but I have extended that invite many, many times. But it's just no, it's that's a good question because I I don't know. And um I mean I think there's something I I think there's something deeper there. Yeah that that drove drove her wanting to be there and um for you and for her. Yeah. Yeah. For both of you guys. I'm I'm definitely grateful for that. And um you know it's it going to that three-week gap of um because I think it's it's really important for people to hear, it's like w what should your reaction be? And it's like how how who what's the what is the right answer of what you should do navigating something like that? And which nobody nobody can answer that question. But I chose to, man, I I went running a lot. And um, I've never been a wicked big runner, but I started working out over the past like couple of years. Um actually just I think navigating hard times, that was kind of my out, which I s I like to say to people it's better than you know getting you know trashed, drunk or you know, messed up on drugs or whatever. And um I remember I remember two days two days after that. I remember going for a run, and um it was just you know, kind of questioning like what the hell am I doing, and at the same time, um just what that was able to allow me to process while I was doing that, and um you know, I I just it's annoyed me because I felt like people were judging how I was handling, not feel like there were people that were judging I like I that I was out doing physical things like that and just not sitting home. Isn't that crazy? Like they probably would not have judged you or wouldn't be thinking that if you were sitting at home with a bottle of jack, they'd been like, oh yeah, I understand it, but yeah, but the fact that you're doing something else uh that's actually better for you mentally and emotionally than the alcohol, they they can't understand that. Yep. Um, you know, and so we got we got I my hopes weren't completely shut down for the possibility of my daughter turning things around. I was, you know, I'm I'm doing the one thing that I could do, and I was praying and praying and praying, and um and the weird thing was like even now, like I've never felt like bitter towards my faith. Or you know, I just I I trust and it's it's one of those things I say, I trust in whatever this crazy plan is, but I'm like, boy, do I have some I have some freaking questions whenever I'm able to be hopefully I someday I get to ask questions. But um when we got closer to the end of that 21-day stretch, the the the three weeks, um I remember, you know, they the doctors called us in a room, and essentially the determination of her MRIs was that it there's so much damage, they're shearing in the left, they're shearing in the right, and they're shearing in the center, and at the brain stem, and it was just there was like there's too much pressure buildup, and they're like, even if she were to ever come out of this, like she'll probably be a vegetable. But like sounded like it was best case scenario. And um, you know, and that's that's I've struggled. I struggle with that right now, where I'm like, you hear stories. I had somebody on our podcast, um Ari, where it was she was told she'll never walk again. She went from being told that to being on the dance floor in like I think I forgot it's like 31 days or something like that. Like she was really soon. And it's like you hear these miracles, but um then it's like when out when I had I did get a second opinion from another neurologist that I was friends with that I used to work with at a medical facility just for my own peace of mind, and he he didn't disagree with the determination from the doctors, and it's just like you know, then you gotta make that decision, like because there was pressure buildup in the brain, so it's like she could in theory be in pain while she's in coma. So it's like if if I'm you don't want your kid to be sitting there in pain, then you gotta make the determination to pull life support. And um, you know, like with you know, we we sat down, kind of had a family talk, like with her side of the my um ex-wife's side of the family and stuff too, and like at this point, and we decided like you know, that that's the route that we should go. You know, I I I my mind always goes back when I think of this thought. When she was 14, I remember she was being there's a rambunctious time frame where she was um being mouthy and stuff, and I remember being down in her room and I was on on her bedroom floor holding her in my arms, she's crying, I'm crying. I'm like, I'm never giving up on you. And I just I I part of me thinks back to that, because I'm like, did I give up on her by not having them continue life support? And I you know, and I I don't think I necessarily did the right or wrong thing from a moral standpoint, it wasn't ill intent, but I still like wonder, I'm like, what if there was that miracle that could have happened? But because you know, we had to do if people if I never knew this was a thing. Have you ever heard of an honor walk? No. So I didn't know this existed. Good. I'm gonna inform you on something. You're gonna learn something, Rob. So when somebody's uh when somebody passes away that's an organ donor, what they will do is they they walked her from the ICU down to the Surgery OR, and they did an honor walk, and a lot of people showed up. They like lined the hospital walls, all her friends and family. And so myself, Monica and Bradley, and two of Kylie's aunts walk my daughter down while music's playing to the OR to pull life support. I feel bad for anybody watching this because it's like, you know, it's it's it's dark, it's it's deep, but and it it's relevant because which I want to I want to get to in a minute. I don't want to go too long on the either, but long longer sc long story short, you know, we go to the OR and you know, yeah they pull life support from her. And um again, it's an experience you can't explain. I hope you never have to do with anybody, but um I mean fast forward a little bit, fast forward maybe a little bit. Yep. Tell me about Kylie. What was she like personality-wise? Oh, she's fire. Full of life, full of life, yeah. She loved loud and laughing. Yeah. She always loved doing things with me. She loved uh she uh one of the last couple things, she likes skiing a lot. Downhill skiing. Sorry. And uh one of the last things we did together, we studded our snowmobile tracks. I don't know if you ever studded a snowmobile track. That's it. I don't even know. Studding a snowmobile. Well, if you're from the up north, when you say studding something, I'm thinking of like breeding, and I know it's not breeding snowmobiles, so that's it's putting metal spikes in the rubber track of the sled, and um it was I know about studding tires, though. Okay. Same same thing, yeah. Okay. That was just something we did together, and like she was she would always want to she helped me do electrical in the garage and stuff. She liked trying to do some of the Tommy. Very hands-on stuff. She liked helping people. Yeah. And uh always wanting her hair braided. That was like she always asked me to like like the pigtail braids that go down all the time. You know, with I know it doesn't matter me saying this, but uh you made the right decision. Yeah. You did. And when you tell me about her, tell me about her being an organ donor. Yeah. And she would not want it want to be a vegetable. Right. No, no, I know she's a good idea. She would be so pissed off. And the fact that she can give life to so many people. There are there are five people affected from the organ donation, too. So there were even more. And more. That wasn't including like um small tissues and stuff like that, but there was people five people directly affected from that. So I mean that's uh I would bet that's probably what she wants, she would she would want. Yeah. Yeah. No, absolutely. I remember I remember when I took her to get a permit and I told her about the whole organ donation thing, and she's like, no thought, she's like, yeah, what do I what would I do with him? You know. Yeah. But um, and just to since I talked a little bit about her, I talk about Tyler, man. Like Tyler was he was the all the parts of me that I wanted to fix that I didn't like about myself. Like, I I've always been pretty insecure, had confidence issues, and like I always wished I did more. Like I wish I tried harder in school and did wrestling. For whatever reason, I wish I did wrestling just because that one-on-one, um, that it's just such a confidence boost. And I got him in and he was nervous as hell, awkward, just like I am and was. And but he like it watching him grow up from ninth grade to his junior year doing that. He like he loved it. Like his life, and he got confident, and he was he was working out with me and stuff. He was my I mean, we we did a lot together. Um we run a lot together, and he was such a helper, like no matter what, he he would be the first one to be there to help. Yeah, just just taught him how to use the chainsaw and stuff. You know, he was getting he went from being like like a hundred-pound pipsqueak to you know, he's six foot tall, you know, when he passed away, give or take. And uh, you know, I'm I am I'm grateful though, man. I had 16 amazing years with him and 18 with Kylie. You know, well, definitely learned a lot. So they sound like two amazing kids, they really do. Yeah, they are. They are. But um, yeah, and they ended up crowning my son as the prom king. Um, this this was this um a couple months ago, the junior class voted for him to be the prom king, and um they were good, they asked me if they wanted me to mail the crown or if I wanted to pick it up, if they wanted to present me, and I'm like, um, I'll go in. And I'm I asked if I could thank the junior class, and I did. Um, I'm terrified. I mean, yeah, I uh we do a podcast, I'm terrified of public speaking. It's my different, it is very different. And um uh, but I did, I went in there and I spoke to 130 junior kids, and I I was nervous, but I didn't I didn't choke at all. I was pretty proud of myself. And um, she went with me to listen, and um, and I I told them, I'm like, everyone here is gonna hit rock bottom at some point. I'm like, and every single person, including the principal, the teachers, every student. I'm like, if you can think back to your junior year of high school and you can think back to this awkward, nervous person standing in front of you right now and think he didn't give up, you got no excuse. You have no excuse, like I said, you know, to go down a bad path. And um, because that's that's my thing is like everybody that I know that has done bad things with their life and went down a bad path, everybody blames it on something they went through. Right bullshit. That's it's a choice. Right, it's a cruise. It's an absolute choice. People like to rationalize all their bad decisions based off their negative life happenings. Right. There's a point, like as you're growing up and maturing and getting older, like you know right from wrong and you know how people should be treated. You want to be treated good, treat other people good. Yeah. And I I think the thing is not only do you could you not make a bad choice because of these hard things, you could make a you could make a decision to be stronger because of it. You can make a decision to be better because of what you've been through. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. I just I know my son and my daughter that they wouldn't want me to be broken because of this. Um, and you know, it's all I do. I already missed my daughter for quite a long time. So I was it yes, losing her was very different than missing her, but I was not used to not being around my son. So it was like a lot of my thoughts would you know transition to think about him all the time. But I'm I'd a lot of times I would just think about him talking shit to me and just be like, Dad, like you'd be alright, you know. And then you you mentioned something earlier, I wanted to touch upon this as my ex-wife, you know, like it was weird, it was like October. I woke up one morning and I was like, like, I never grieved over losing her. And like at one point in time, and I remember waking up and telling her this, and I was like, it's kind of an awkward conversation to have with your current wife. I'm like, at one point in time I loved her similarly to how I love you. Like, like, you know, I love how I love, that's who I am, you know. Right. At one point in time, you know, I was with her for 14 years and three kids, like you said. I mean, that's there's a lot of memories there, and and unfortunately, a lot of like the more recent bad memories tend to overpower the good memories, but there were there weren't a lot we didn't have a horrible relationship or anything. We we just we parted ways at some point, and but man, I I just I thought to myself, like it's just crazy. It's crazy how things unwinded because in hindsight 2020, and the things I wish I could have done differently, and you know, when I look at photos or think of the kids, it's like that is life. Everyone feels like that, no matter what. Oh, I just think there are things that we all wish we could do differently, but no matter who you are or what you go through, you're gonna feel like that about something. Yeah, but and I'm uh I'm very active with kids. I love doing things with them. But man, like when I'm looking at photos and I just see myself just living through the moments in the everyday, like whether it's hiking or going camping with them or whatever it was, I'm just like, man, I just wish I absorbed it more, you know, and yeah, that anybody's gonna think that. But you can't soak it in enough. Yeah. Oh Monica, a question for you. Yes. How have you been through all this? Because I know it's not easy. Yeah. Matt's kids, right? But they were also a part of of you, part of your life. But also it's it's your spouse that you're supporting and you want to be there for them. That's a lot on you, and I think a lot of time people forget that, you know, and and Matt, I am not taking anything away from you. Oh, you're absolutely right. But there's a there's a lot on you. How is uh tell me about that? How's that been? Difficult for sure. Um, but I oh goodness, I went through a lot in my past too to strengthen me because if I didn't go through, I was in an abusive relationship for about seven years, and there's a that's a whole different story, but that built my armor to be like, you know, to think positive, to have my faith, to just be strong. Um, so it I was like his rock, I'm Bradley's rock, and my other two daughters like I'm there for them too. So it is it's difficult to try to balance, you know, making sure he's okay and all my kids are okay, and then the rest of our family, because they're grieving as well. But like you gotta make sure you're okay. So I gotta I gotta take care of myself too. Yeah. Um, I think most of the time, which I know is not right, because I will give advice and be like, you know, you need to do self-love and do what you need to do to take care of yourself too. I stay busy, but I also I think, like I said before, I'm in like this denial stage still, and I might be for a while. And it it comes in waves, but I I'll think about them and get sad, but then I'm unfortunately very good about like changing what I'm thinking about and thinking I can think about something different pretty quickly to make myself not cry. Because there's so many times during the days where I'm like you know, at school with the kids and I'm like, oh my gosh, I like think of things and I'm like, don't cry right now, and then I have to like think of something different, and it's it's all the same. Yeah, but you you've gotta eventually let yourself process it too. And and I know as the spouse, as the partner, a lot of times you're kind of the forgotten one, right? Yeah, or you know, and and um I mean you are. Um and Matt, I'm not saying that you have forgotten her or anything else, but people maybe call and yeah, maybe people call and check on you, but they're calling, hey, I'm just calling to see how Matt's doing. It's like Matt's good, I'm kind of having a shit day, you know. But you can't say that, but it's well here, you want to talk to him here? Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, you're and you're 100% right, because there's been many times where I've felt like that. Yeah, you know, but I'm I'm in a place in my mind where I know I know people think about all of us, you know, and I know they were his kids, but they were a part of my life for a long time too. So you've got a good you guys have a good group around you. Yes, yeah. Yeah, we have more support than we could have ever hoped for in in three years, because it's not again, it's not just since last summer, in three years of navigating a lot of tragedy. Like, there's never been a point in time where I was like worried about our relationship. And I think that that's gotta be rare. I imagine Well, that's one thing that I thought of. I'm sorry to interrupt, but I was like thinking in my head when he was telling the story of just like the last two and a half years of like the custody battle and all that. Like, I'm not speaking for everyone, but I think a lot of people would be like, I'm out, because it was so hard. And there were times where, you know, I mean, like what what do you do when you are so stressed to the limit with stuff that we cannot control, and then we're both on edge, you know, and you know, I'm like too much. That's common. That's common for divorces to happen during that period. Right. And it is. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Now I will say, like, if there were if if she were to have left or said, I can't do this anymore at any certain point, but I lindsight 2020, I would say, you know, I don't blame her, man. Like Yeah, but I also it is, but I also want to show people that there is light at the end of the tunnel, be there for each other, love each other, support each other. And if there's things that you guys are not um agreeing with, there there's always compromising with some things. Happiness, I think, is a choice. Just like, you know, I think I think you can put effort into loving someone too. People don't people don't think that like you it's either there or it's not. No, I think you can you can put effort into showing that affection when people need it and just being that like we we still do like little notes in the morning, you know? It's like little things like that that really I think make make a relationship work really good, you know. It's just little silly things that make your heart happy. Yeah, and faith is still big with you guys, man. Yes, yep, yeah. Yep. So I don't I don't know where I wanna I want to talk about Bradley. How how how is how is he? He's doing, I think, way better than what anyone would think. I s I said to him really early on, I said, Brad, I'm like, listen, I'm like, this is gonna do one of two things, and I don't think there is an in-between. I'm like, this is gonna make us or break us. And I'm like, what I mean by this is you're 12 years old. I'm like, if I can navigate this and if I can somehow, you know, I I say get through. I don't think you're ever threw something like this, but if I can navigate something through, at the amount of resilience that I would gain from this, I'm like, at 12 years old, you're never gonna go anything through anything worse than this. I mean, ope to God, but like this is pretty much as bad as it gets. So if you can navigate through this, you get life by the balls. Like, this is you'll you'll be alright. And um, and he's got a really good mindset, and he him too, man. Like, like I say, I'm I'm more grateful now for every day than I ever have been my entire life. And now that doesn't mess necessarily mean I'm like, oh yeah, I'm happy everything happened. No, but like I am, I'm more appreciative because I mean what option is there to be? I could be more bitter and miserable that I could go that route too, and that would be pretty understandable. But no, I'm I I think just being more appreciative and grateful and I think I think um when he gets sad though, like he's so good about expressing like that's great. He would show us videos or talk about it, and then two minutes later he's fine. You know, so he's very good about hey, I'm sad. We made an agreement. We we said, listen, we're gonna talk about anything. And I'm like, I don't care if you think you might make me sad, but vice versa. If I have any memories or any thoughts come up, I'll talk to you about them. I'm like, we'll just we'll talk about things until it doesn't make us sad anymore. And it and I think that has been one of the most beneficial things, um, even I mean for me as well. And um, you know, he's he's doing it. Bradley said, I think I think you said he on the way from the accident scene, he said, we're gonna be happy again. Yeah. Yeah. Have you seen him happy? We're gonna be happy again. Uh I mean, and you've seen him happy since. And oh yeah. I I imagine those times when you guys are together and you're each happy, I I would imagine those are probably even extra special. Oh my gosh, yeah, man. Yep. You know, I was telling you a story when we first talked about um I had a guy on here, Stephen Panas, um, about a year ago, he had lost his son, Jake, uh, in an accident, um, vehicle accident. And he had a young he had a younger son. Unfortunately, I cannot remember the name of his younger son. He still he has a younger son. And you know, I told you a story, and I've got it on my social media pages as well. But he tells a story of he told his um younger son to go up to his room and get a buck knife and to come outside. And he does. And they go out to a tree and they carve bark off a part of the tree. And he told his son, and again, I would anybody listening, I would say, go back to my social media page, it was probably about a year ago, um, maybe in May of 25. Um and he says, you know, the tree this tree is going to this is going to look different. And it's similar to us, but it's going to be okay. It's not ever going to be the same. It's going to grow back, but it's going it, you know, but it's it it's going to be okay. Um and again, I am completely butchering what he said, but it was uh it was an old Indian thing that he had on there, I mean that he had read. And um he tells a story later on about how his son one day came in and said, Dad, dad, dad, it's healing. The you see Bart coming back on there, and the fact that it's gonna take a while. Yeah, but it is gonna grow back and it might look different, but it's we're going to be okay. The tree's gonna be okay, and we're gonna be okay. Yeah. And um I like that. Yeah, yeah. I'll have to send you that clip. You know, it makes me think of the reason why I actually reached out to you to begin with, which uh, you know, do a shout out to Terry Tucker. Yeah. Um Terry Tucker we had on our podcast. I think Terry Tucker has been on everyone's podcast. Yeah, probably. Um and for good reason. And um, and I remember when we talked to him, I'm like, I I just I was so happy we had that conversation. But I don't think I might have told you this, I don't think I did, but I we recorded a podcast with him, and it was one of I think it was our last remote podcast, and I completely forgot to ever even air it because we we got busy with life and we started doing a bunch of traveling to do in-person podcasts, then in October, so this is after the accident. We recorded last February, so way before the accident, ended up editing it in October, and as I'm editing this and listening to it, it was like I was meant to hear this conversation, strangely enough, with me, it's my own conversation that I already had with this man. And one of the things that he said in this podcast that has echoed through my life, and it's just nonstop, is you never have any idea how many people are watching how you handle your adversity. True. And I think that is so important. And I don't think that means because people are watching you should pretend to be strong, but I think you can make a choice to attempt to be stronger than you know, be weak and uh just do things like the the right way, like there's many right ways, but like the healthy way. And and I know he said on your show, is I think this is one of his staples that is just so important, you know, because he's got cancer and he he you know says if if cancer could have if he could have changed having cancer, he does it's like I don't know if I would have it. He said he made him a better person. And again, I think perspective, it's it's everything, man. Um I think uh I th I think as you're saying that too, I think about Bradley and I think about what he's been through, but how you guys have handled it, but the the modeling that you've shown him. Yeah, the resilience and to pick yourself back up. Look, there's story after story I can tell you of parents that didn't handle things right. Yeah. And you know, how can you be upset with your kids if when they experience a hard time if they turn to alcohol and drugs and you know something abusive and harmful to them? I mean, how how can you blame them? That's what you've shown them. Yeah. And it's it's a um you know Bradley's fortunate to have you two in his life. Really is appreciative. What um I won't I want to be cognizant of your time, but what do you what do you how how do you how do you guys go forward? Like what was the determination like was there was there ever a time when you were like, all right, this is life. How do I like what is it gonna look like? I mean, how are we going to go forward? I won't I won't speak for both of us, but I think it's probably simple. With how difficult things were leading up to this, like I tell people, I'm like, I don't know what has been more of a challenge. And I'm not saying one's worse than the other, they're very different, but like when you've already been through hell for quite a long time, and um it's obviously again very different than losing your kids. However, like I was already pretty much maxed out on the stress factor in the um, so I think I don't want to say man, in in a lot of ways, maybe it's a good thing that my ex-wife and I went through that custody battle because I think I was so calloused, you know, kind of like the bark on the tree. I think like it already was damaged and it started growing back and probably stronger. It's like in the beginning we are already getting um going through something to get us stronger because you know this was gonna happen. So it's like we're already training for something. A friend said to you, we're already training for something or preparing ourselves for something that we didn't know what we were preparing ourselves for, yeah. And getting stronger and stronger because of July. Well, and I I say to people. Because there's a there's a there was a chunk of time where I thought in my head, I'm like, I got my ex-wife to go to church. Go me. Like I had this thought in my head that me talking to my son was what got her there. And then I'm like, after the accident, I remember one day it clicked, I'm like, holy shit, she got me to go to church. We didn't go through any of that, I never would have went in there. When I I don't know, I I don't even remember like where I was as far as a mindset directly after things happened, but I just kind of just like I did, I just kind of kept going. Like and um this so and it it's it is in relation to the exactly that um throughout the winter, you know, I'm running and it's negative 10 degrees out, and there's people that are like, you know, message me, you're that's dangerous, you're crazy, and I'm like, Well people don't understand is when you choose to continue on in those days that are where nobody is outside, people aren't driving their cars, let alone outside running, and yeah, you got me out here doing you know, seven, eight, nine miles and in a blizzard of it's those hard moments of pushing yourself physically for me, they've helped me so much. Or, you know, like you talked about cold plunging earlier, you know, that intentional discomfort because you're not gonna find strength in comfort. I I hate I hate to get some people get weird when you talk about David Goggins because you know he can be controversial in some ways. Who's gonna carry the boat? Yeah, you know. But I I love I love that idea, and I have recently heard him say that. He's like, you you're not gonna find strength in a in a comfortable environment. You're not gonna find strength through a comfortable environment. Like it's absolutely right. Nowadays, especially everybody wants to be comfortable. Yeah, you know, and yeah, well, I was gonna say too, I don't think there was not one day where we're like, man, we can't do this. Man, you know, we're just not gonna do it, or we're gonna get so depressed where we lose our jobs. You know, there was never for me, there was never a thought like that. And maybe if one of you was kind of feeling that way, you had the other one to kind of push you. Yeah. You know, maybe there was that too. Y'all are such a great team. I mean, such a great team. Thank you. It's the reason why God puts you guys together, right? I mean absolutely. I think so. There's there's reasons there. Yeah. All right, from each of from each of you. And what would I want to know what advice would you give parents in general? Or what would you say to parents in general? And then what would you say to parents that are that are that have gone through something like this as well? Okay, so I immediately have very two very different answers for those two points. Um right now I think like one something I see, you know, whether it's at work and my my friends that have kids and stuff, there's a lot of parents out there that take a lot of their parenting is just throwing tablets in front of their kids or you know, sitting at the dinner table with their with their kids and they're they're they have the TV on or they're on their phones. And like those moments are so important, and kids need boredom. Kids don't need to be constantly engaged by these electronics, they need you know because if they're not bored, the creativity aspect of their mind is never going to be able to develop and um those those moments. Um and then to the back to the other point of that for actually before I get to the parents that have gone or have gone through significant loss. I look back at a lot of moments, like I'll use my trampoline in my backyard, for example. There's nine out of ten time nine out of ten ten times when my um kids would ask me if I'd play gaga ball, which is like dodgeball in the trampoline. Yeah, I was too busy. And was I really too busy? I might have been some of the times, but it's like what I would do to go back to play with my kid one more time. And um, so when you hear somebody like me or us talk about what going through this tragic loss, it's like just do your best to live in the moment and and think about those those those little things that you're taking for granted every day. And I think it's so important. And it's human nature, you're gonna do those things, but um now as far as the people that have gone through significant loss, whether it's their kids or their wives, because we've we've talked with a lot of people like that, it's like oh man, I if you're not a person of faith, you know, I I don't like pushing faith upon anybody, but I don't know where I would be if if I didn't have that element of faith of just thinking, hey, there's gotta be something good that can come out of this horrible situation. And whether or not that's us having this conversation here and somebody sees it, like that's because this is silver lining. This this is um, it's you know, hopefully this impacts one person, and um, like I think that's what it's all about is being there for other people. And for me personally, the most healing thing I can possibly do for myself, because I have so many broken days. Like, don't let me fool you. I have so many days where I'm driving into work crying this week, and um but it's so healing to be able to talk to people and be there for people. Like my my empathy, I feel like has been elevated to a point where you know it's it's wild. It's it but um yeah, yeah. I just I feel like with people that still have their kids, um try to make more memories, like he was talking about the electronics and the phones, you know, and just their faces being glued to them, maybe set more time aside to make more memories. And because a lot of times, I mean, I know a lot of parents that just you know, you're at a restaurant and the kid's got like the tablet right in front of his face and they're not talking. And it's like that one moment right there could change a little bit, you know, the directory of like your lives and just making more memories and communicating to each other and loving each other and stuff. And it's not always about the places you go or anything like that. It's the day it's the day-to-day, it's the conversations. Family dinners. If you can do it, some people can't. Yeah, just little things like that are I think are and and remember your kids, they're always watching. They're watching how you interact with your significant other. They're watching what you eat, they're watching what you if you work out or if you're a lazy, you know, it's like or they're watching how you deal stress. They're watching how you handle adversity. Yeah, they soak everything in. Um they really do. I mean, and people are like, oh my gosh, I can't believe you know Bradley says certain things that he says or does, and it's like like that's we've been showing him this stuff for so long, and it's so rewarding to see just the goodness coming out of him like that, and I know that he'll be okay. Yeah, so yeah. Monica, what would you say to parents that are going through something or people that are are going through loss? Um, I know sometimes there isn't a father or mother in the picture, and if someone does go through loss, they feel like they don't have that other person like Matt and I have each other. So I know that I can't imagine how hard that like that would be, but there's always someone there that wants to support you and help you, and it's okay to reach out for help. And I know a lot of times people just seclude themselves when they're going through things, and um I just ask for help. Tell people that you're you know sad, and there's gonna be someone out there. There's probably a million people out there that want to help you. We we don't mind talking to people if anybody sees this and they feel like they're going through help. Yeah, reach out. Yeah, just don't don't be alone. And I know a lot of people are like, well, I am alone, I don't have anybody, but there's always people out there, and I think that's number one because as human beings, we're supposed to get through hard times like this together. We're not meant to do it alone. Yeah, you know a couple things. I had um Drew Parker on here a few weeks ago, and he's a uh country artist. Um he's written some hits for Luke Combs and different ones, and he he has personally gotten into he's still writing uh some country songs, um even on Luke Combs' new album. But he's gotten into Christian music, singing, performing Christian music, writing and and singing. And um it's a fascinating story with him, but and I'll close the circle. We were talking about uh about praying for somebody or asking somebody to pray for you. And for me personally, that's so tough. I think it's very tough. Yeah. But you know, I love it when somebody says, and I feel like it's an honor when they said, Hey, will you pray for me? I'm going through a hard time. Like I feel like me? Definitely is. I know. Like, you think I'm worthy enough? Yeah, but it's really hard to ask somebody for me, it is to ask somebody, will you pray for me? But I think that is so important, and people will do that as well. In a heartbeat. Yeah, you never know the impact that asking somebody that could have on them, too. Yes. Um, I just went to dinner with a guy last week. I haven't seen him in 30 years since grade school. By the time we were done talking, he's like, he's like, Do you mind if we pray? And I like, yeah, man, like held hands with this other man at this Dunkin' Donuts, and you know, and I'm like, I got in the car immediately. I'm like, I'm never gonna forget the conversation I just had with this guy. Yeah, uh not many people do that because it's it is it's you know it's stepping out of comfort zone for sure, you know. It's intimate, you know. And the other thing is I love what you guys are doing. I know you were doing this before um with the podcast, but I love how you're being vulnerable and you're out there helping other people. And um I don't like sharing me stories about my sons, um, and I have to be careful with it, but I'm gonna share one regardless. Um when I was when their mom and I were going through a divorce, one of my sons, I can literally take you to the exact place in Atlanta where in the middle of rush hour traffic. And he was sitting in the back and he said, Dad, you know, God doesn't like divorce. And I'm like, I'm thinking, okay, where's this coming from and where's this going? He said, but you know, we're gonna be okay. And he wants us to help other people that are going through it as well. And that's one of those moments where you know it's later on, I was like, what made you say that? He said, I don't I don't know. Where did that come from? I I don't know. I just it just came out, dad. And so I have done that, you know, in my personal life. I mean, a little bit with the podcast, but then you know, there's um a group that I help on Monday nights as well through my church, through a divorce recovery. And I I love what you guys are doing, and I think my point is when you go through this adversity, it's very easy to I made it through it. It's too hard to to relive this in other people. Because look, when people start telling you your stor telling you their story, I know I'm I would imagine for you guys, you're reliving part of yours each and every time. Yeah. And it's tough. It's tough. But you're also helping others by doing that. And you're changing, you know, you're helping them, which is probably helping their kids or their loved ones, and changing, probably changing a generation or two with that. And preventing something negative that could come from it, it could come from it. And I just I want to commend you guys and say thank you for doing that. And I think it's beautiful what you're doing. I really do. I appreciate it, man. Likewise, likewise. No, but I I do, I appreciate you guys doing it. I know this is you know still very fresh, and it's gonna take time and praying for you guys, for both of you, as as y'all go through and navigate this, and as well as Bradley, yeah, as well. And I'm you know, I I appreciate you guys uh sharing about Kylie and Tyler as well, and sharing more about them. Anything else we missed or that you guys want to share? I believe so. Of course, I had something a few minutes ago and now it's gone, but you're and I talked you through I talked through it, made you forget I couldn't. Oh no, you're fine. You're fine. That's me. I I apologize. I do, I appreciate this. Um, you know, I I gotta say, when I heard this quote, it's been echoing through my mind for a few years now, and um it's by Admiral Mick Raven. It's um in order to change the world, you must be your very best in your darkest moments. And um that has been something before the accident echoed through my brain, and now it's like man, I guess it's an opportunity, right? Yeah. So uh I wanna one, I want to know how how can people find you, and then two, the Matt and Monica podcast. We got the Matt and Monica Podcast.com is our website. Um, we have we're on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, we're on all the socials, um, Instagram, Facebook, TikTok. I I post stuff on TikTok, but it's I'm not really on there. Um, LinkedIn is probably my biggest networking. Um I I use LinkedIn, I find a lot of guests through LinkedIn, I just about all of them. So, but um, you know, I'm pretty big on Facebook and Instagram as well. Yep, but um I'll I'll put a link uh to your socials on there as well. I will certainly do it. Thank you. Thank you. Look, I I just um I appreciate you again, I appreciate you guys coming on. I'm sorry. Uh my heart breaks for you guys. I'm sorry for what you guys have gone through, but I do thank you for how you're using that to help other people through this. I mean, I definitely don't think there's any other way for us. Yeah. Yeah, which is which is beautiful. So all right. Well, thank you all. Thank you again. Okay, and look, thank thank you all for listening to the Dad Dads podcast. You can find us on Spotify or Apple Podcasts, as well as most platforms. You can also find us on Instagram and YouTube. Don't forget to hit the like and subscribe button so you don't miss any future episodes. Uh, and feel free to leave comments. Again, thank you all, and we will talk to you next time. Take care, guys.